Talk:Nihilism

Credible source to cite...

"The Matrix and Philosophy" by William Irwin...see chapter 13...(how appropriate)...

nemo senki

Nihilism in films

I think that in the movie "Melancholia" from Lars von Trier, the character Justine, played by Kirsten Dunst is also a nihilist type of person. Yes, depression is also one of her problems, but at the end she is kind of happy that the world is ending, for her there is no sense of existing. Not even for her nephew, a boy, worth to panic because of the end approaching.

this page is kind of a disaster.

as a nihilist, who reads and writes nihilist essays, and has been involved in nihilist movements and communities for many years, it's really concerning to me that there are so many drastic misconceptions about nihilism presented as fact on the wikipedia page, for instance the claim in the introduction that nihilism opposes concepts like objective truth and knowledge.

that misconception likely arises from the myth of "epistemological nihilism", which doesn't actually exist as a philosophy, but also has a section devoted to it on the Nihilism page. the phrase, as far as i can tell, originates from a 1987 paper by Thomas Upton, criticizing Richard Rorty, calling his philosophy "epistemological nihilism", as an insult. it isn't a real position nihilists hold--and it would be impossible to hold that position, since claiming that it's impossible to know anything would paradoxically be claiming to know that knowledge is unattainable.

nihilism, on the contrary, asserts several objective truths, like the illogical nature of morality, and the nonexistence of a "meaning of life".

nihilism has a relatively clear history and trajectory, and there are many nihilist essays and books being written today, on topics ranging from queerness and gender-nihilism ("Bædan", the "What is Gender Nihilism?" reader, "Terror Incognita", "No Future: Queer Theory and the Death Drive", etc.), to political analysis and praxis ("Nihilism, Anarchy, and the 21st Century", "Blessed is the Flame", "Vørtext", etc.), and all kinds of other topics, but rather than actually nihilistic texts and authors, this page seems primarily (almost entirely) focused on exploring philosophers who are peripherally associated with nihilism in one way or another, and on those who are erroneously labeled as nihilists (Kierkegaard, Buddhists, etc.) apparently due to a misconception about what nihilism actually is, and those who argued against their understanding of nihilism (most notably Nietzsche), rather than exploring much actual nihilist thought and action.

this page would be much better off eliminating the section on Buddhism entirely, replacing the mention of Kierkegaard with Stirner (who didn't call himself a nihilist, but unlike Kierkegaard, was influential to later nihilists) or Nechayev, or even Turgenev...maybe Kropotkin...and making it clear that while Nietzsche used the word "nihilism" a lot, he largely was just using it as an insult for anything he didn't like, and he himself was not a nihilist. Renzo Novatore was arguably the most famous nihilist, but i don't think he's mentioned at all...there are several nihilist philosophers currently writing, who aren't mentioned, and whose ideas aren't represented, but post-modernism gets its own section...

all in all, i would say this page is mostly wrong and largely misguided, and many of the segments are clearly based on misunderstandings of nihilism. Sera Toxin (talk) 05:50, 9 January 2022 (UTC)

You are welcome to make any proposed changes yourself, please see WP:BEBOLD. A general lament on the prior work of other editors is not the purpose of the talk page as there is no editor-in-chief, please see WP:NOTAFORUM. Lexlex (talk) 13:56, 28 January 2022 (UTC)

Are you seriously trying to get into trouble here? Bro, be serious, this is getting ridiculous,will you at least ever give it a chance? Wikipedia's guidelines are already super complicated and strict, and you tell me that? Bro, no one is perfect, everyone makes mistakes, I'm already getting angry with this kind of thing. Give me constructive arguments, otherwise I will ask you to delete this immediately, your choice. 177.105.94.163 (talk) 15:24, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Ok, I recognize that there may be mistakes in this article, but for God's sake, calling it a "disaster" is already an exaggeration, besides that this is very unpleasant on your part, one of the biggest problems of this community, which besides thinking it is the absolute truth, they exaggerate so much when they are going to criticize. 177.105.94.163 (talk) 15:31, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

As Sera Toxin pointed out, there are many misunderstandings in the current definition of nihilism. Nihilism is simply about questioning absolute values, and the extreme conclusions emphasized in the definition should be seen as deviations from the core of the philosophy. Therefore, the changes made to this definition should reflect real nihilist perspectives, as Sera Toxin has suggested, and offer a more balanced view that doesn't focus solely on Nietzsche’s extreme conclusions. With this approach, a more neutral and accurate definition of nihilism can be provided. Rahmiaydogan (talk) 14:59, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

Correcting Misinterpretations in the Definition of Nihilism

In a recent edit, the first sentence of the Nihilism article was revised. The previous definition presented nihilism as a philosophical approach that rejects generally accepted or fundamental aspects of human existence (such as knowledge, morality, or meaning) entirely. However, we have modified this to emphasize that nihilism questions the absolute validity of such aspects but does not inherently lead to a specific outcome, such as the rejection of all values.

The original sentence was: Nihilism is a family of views within philosophy that rejects generally accepted or fundamental aspects of human existence, such as knowledge, morality, or meaning.

After our revision, the sentence now reads: Nihilism is a philosophical approach that rejects the absolute validity of commonly accepted or fundamental aspects of human existence, such as knowledge, morality, or meaning, while not directing towards any specific conclusion, such as the rejection of values.

This change highlights the mistaken emphasis in previous definitions, which were heavily influenced by critics of nihilism, such as Nietzsche, who focused on extreme outcomes. Nihilism provides a framework for questioning absolute values, but it does not demand that all values be rejected. Therefore, we are challenging definitions rooted in extreme interpretations provided by philosophers like Crosby and Deleuze.

Our edit summary: In defining nihilism as a philosophy of questioning, we have made a correction to remove interpretations that emphasize extreme conclusions and aim to restore philosophical neutrality. We welcome constructive feedback on this revision. Rahmiaydogan (talk) 14:45, 13 September 2024 (UTC)